C47 Classic single shift, replaces C43 on DM42

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Jaymos
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Re: C47 Classic single shift, replaces C43 on DM42

Post by Jaymos »

Bill K. - USA wrote:
Sun May 28, 2023 10:15 pm
Jaymos wrote:
Sun May 28, 2023 8:40 pm
Bill K. - USA wrote:
Sun May 28, 2023 7:39 pm
...An alternate idea, BTW, would be to replace the up/down arrows with "CAT" or an ellipsis or some other symbol/text, if people found that helpful.
Any other comments from other users (or developers) on this?
Note this would only be for displaying Catalogues, not Menus, so that users would know that the three rows at the bottom of the display scroll by one line at a time (not three) and that Alpha-mode jumps are now active. (So maybe "α" [the alpha symbol] instead of the up & down arrows.)
Dani R suggested to me to make non-coloured in arrows for the catalogs and solid arrows for the normal menus.
That is a good idea and will probably be done.
Jaco Mostert
Elec Eng, South Africa
https://47calc.com C47 (s/n 03818 & 06199), WP43 (0015). In box: HP42S, HP32Sii, WP34S&C, HP28C, HP35s, EL-506P, EL-W506, PB700; ex: FX702P, 11C, HP67 & HP85; iOS: 42s Byron, Free42+, WP31S/34S, HCalc.
pm42
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Re: C47 Classic single shift, replaces C43 on DM42

Post by pm42 »

Jaymos wrote:
Mon May 29, 2023 11:57 pm
Why do you need it?
I want to use it in a program label.
Jaymos wrote:
Mon May 29, 2023 11:57 pm
Either way, the workaround route to get the sign (until I add it) is: Go to FBR (font browser) and look for the sign you need. Degrees is 00B0 on the FBR table. Convert that to decimal, which is 176 and put in X. Use the [x->𝑎] command to get the character. Store somewhere and use, or directly from X add to it, or add it to a string.
Thanks. Once it is in the X register, any way to add it to the MyAlpha menu?
I'm not familiar with characters manipulation and found the documentation a great effort but not easy to navigate.
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Jaymos
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Re: C47 Classic single shift, replaces C43 on DM42

Post by Jaymos »

pm42 wrote:
Tue May 30, 2023 5:22 am
Jaymos wrote:
Mon May 29, 2023 11:57 pm
Why do you need it?
I want to use it in a program label.
Of course, that makes sense. It will be in the next release.

Any other missing characters anyone else wants? It is the same effort to add 2 existing glyphs from the font than it is to add 1.

I will add the degrees sign to the master tonight, If you want to compile the master yourself you can have it early. Actual "release" we hope could happen end of the weekend after next weekend (mid June), but I never promise release dates: understandably in this open source environment we simply do not take on the stress for release promises that do not materialize due to a host of reasons!!

The master is always up to date (working) except for the new feature branches.


Jaymos wrote:
Mon May 29, 2023 11:57 pm
Either way, the workaround route to get the sign (until I add it) is: Go to FBR (font browser) and look for the sign you need. Degrees is 00B0 on the FBR table. Convert that to decimal, which is 176 and put in X. Use the [x->𝑎] command to get the character. Store somewhere and use, or directly from X add to it, or add it to a string.
Thanks. Once it is in the X register, any way to add it to the MyAlpha menu?
I'm not familiar with characters manipulation and found the documentation a great effort but not easy to navigate.
No, there is not!
In the X-register it is only useful to create concatenated strings for display.
Jaco Mostert
Elec Eng, South Africa
https://47calc.com C47 (s/n 03818 & 06199), WP43 (0015). In box: HP42S, HP32Sii, WP34S&C, HP28C, HP35s, EL-506P, EL-W506, PB700; ex: FX702P, 11C, HP67 & HP85; iOS: 42s Byron, Free42+, WP31S/34S, HCalc.
Bill K. - USA
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Re: C47 Classic single shift, replaces C43 on DM42

Post by Bill K. - USA »

Jaymos wrote:
Mon May 29, 2023 11:59 pm
Dani R suggested to me to make non-coloured in arrows for the catalogs and solid arrows for the normal menus.
That is a good idea and will probably be done.
Super--thank you.
pm42
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Re: C47 Classic single shift, replaces C43 on DM42

Post by pm42 »

Jaymos wrote:
Tue May 30, 2023 9:31 am
I will add the degrees sign to the master tonight, If you want to compile the master yourself you can have it early.
I've compiled and installed the new version and it works.
Thanks.
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Jaymos
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Re: C47 Classic single shift, replaces C43 on DM42

Post by Jaymos »

pm42 wrote:
Tue May 30, 2023 10:39 pm
Jaymos wrote:
Tue May 30, 2023 9:31 am
I will add the degrees sign to the master tonight, If you want to compile the master yourself you can have it early.
I've compiled and installed the new version and it works.
Thanks.
Don't be bothered by a minor bug which came for free in the current master, i.e. some f and g line softkeys are struck through as if not in existence, but they do work, it is a display issue only. It has been fixed in the feature branch that I am working on, so just wait for the merge and the announcements.
Jaco Mostert
Elec Eng, South Africa
https://47calc.com C47 (s/n 03818 & 06199), WP43 (0015). In box: HP42S, HP32Sii, WP34S&C, HP28C, HP35s, EL-506P, EL-W506, PB700; ex: FX702P, 11C, HP67 & HP85; iOS: 42s Byron, Free42+, WP31S/34S, HCalc.
avosough
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Re: C47 Classic single shift, replaces C43 on DM42

Post by avosough »

Very exciting project and neat to see the collaboration unfold here on the board. Kudos to the team!

The original post mentioned the idea of eventually supporting the DM32 hardware and maybe even a production run by SwissMicros. Now that DM32 is starting to ship, any fresh thoughts on this? Is it expected to be a simple port over to the new hardware because of commonalities in DMCP or is this more of a long-term "if we get to it" kind of goal?
H2X
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Re: C47 Classic single shift, replaces C43 on DM42

Post by H2X »

avosough wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 4:14 am
Very exciting project and neat to see the collaboration unfold here on the board. Kudos to the team!

The original post mentioned the idea of eventually supporting the DM32 hardware and maybe even a production run by SwissMicros. Now that DM32 is starting to ship, any fresh thoughts on this? Is it expected to be a simple port over to the new hardware because of commonalities in DMCP or is this more of a long-term "if we get to it" kind of goal?
Thanks! The DM32 lacks arrow keys, which we need.
What is the metric tensor in imperial units?
Bill K. - USA
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Re: C47 Classic single shift, replaces C43 on DM42

Post by Bill K. - USA »

From what I understand, the DM32 hardware supports twice the speed and twice the RAM and twice the Flash as the DM42, so it seems like an ideal platform.

But I agree that the DM32--as the keys and template are currently printed--isn't as externally compatible with the C47 project as the DM42 is. But I hope SwissMicros will at some point manufacture the DM32 hardware with the C47/D47 printing. The doubling of the memory is wonderful: if nothing else, that memory expansion could support an extensive Help file right on the calculator itself.

I've been playing with the C47, and although its innovative UI makes the single shift key far more convenient that one might expect, I suspect I might still prefer separate "f" and "g" keys. The D47 key layout (which isn't as far along as the C47), gives the user two shift keys, although I'm not sure if there's a template for it yet. But the C47 keeps being improved by the diligent and crafty calculator gnomes (meant as a compliment!), and when the long-press timing function of the C47 gets refined, I might find myself preferring the C47 over a D47.

In any event, the recent changes to the C47 have me enthusiastic for this project!

I have a few calculators that span the space of the calculator landscape, with the HP-15C/DM15L, the DM42, the HP-50g, the HP Prime G2 being the top contenders for my preferred model.
--The HP Prime G2 display, although full color, looks pixelated, and it feels more like a highly portable mini-computer than a pure calculator.
--The HP-50g has non-keypress, Basic-like programming which is more overhead than I want. And I find the B&W display pixelated.
--The HP-15C has keypress programming, but it shows only the address of the keys pressed, which is difficult to read. And without program- or variable-labeling, it's not ideal for keeping many programs in memory.
--The DM42 is a solid choice, but I found the menus a bit cumbersome to navigate, especially if I hadn't used them in a while.
--The DM42 flashed as a C47 or WP43 is in the sweet spot of what I'm looking for, with the C47 key having the better UI for me.
Last edited by Bill K. - USA on Thu Jun 01, 2023 2:04 pm, edited 2 times in total.
sgleysti
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Re: C47 Classic single shift, replaces C43 on DM42

Post by sgleysti »

Bill K. - USA wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 2:17 pm
I have a few calculators that span the space of the calculator landscape, with the HP-15C/DM15L, the DM42, the HP-50g, the HP Prime G2 being the top contenders for my preferred model.
--The HP Prime G2 display, although full color, looks pixelated, and it feels more like a highly portable mini-computer than a pure calculator.
--The HP-50g has non-keypress, Basic-like programming which is more overhead than I want. And I find the B&W display pixelated.
--The HP-15C has keypress programming, but it shows only the address of the keys pressed, which is difficult to read. And without program- or variable-labeling, it's not ideal for keeping many programs in memory.
--The DM42 is a solid choice, but I found the menus a bit cumbersome to navigate, especially if I hadn't used them in a while.
--The DM42 flashed as a C47 or WP43 is in the sweet spot of what I'm looking for, with the C47 key having the better UI for me.
No idea if it will ever happen, but I think I would love a DM15X. There is a thread about it at viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2407.

Ability to see all the stack variables, more memory, and ability to see glyphs for key values of program lines instead of addresses would be pretty great. Improvements to viewing and/or entry of complex numbers, matrices, and stats wouldn't hurt. That said, keeping the feature set roughly where it is on the 15, to me, would be a good thing. I think they really did a great job of feature scoping the first time.
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