C43/C47 bezel expected when?

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Pyjam
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Re: C43 bezel expected when?

Post by Pyjam »

pm42 wrote:
Sat Mar 11, 2023 4:30 pm
But for most of the people who already use the calculator, have overlays, are familiar with a layout, this is just a pain in the ass.
Exactly why you are using the Qwerty layout. Thank you so much!

  Optimot : The ⌥ keyboard layout optimized for French and English (ŵïþ ʃʉŋ 𝕂åʁɒꝃțɛɹṩ).
pm42
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Re: C43 bezel expected when?

Post by pm42 »

Pyjam wrote:
Sat Mar 11, 2023 5:21 pm
Exactly why you are using the Qwerty layout. Thank you so much!
Yes, the qwerty layout is bad and here only for historical reasons but changing a few keys do not solve the problem. It just make switching keyboards more irritating.
The same is true with calculators layout: a big change can be an improvement. A few small ones are not worth it.
Pyjam
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Re: C43 bezel expected when?

Post by Pyjam »

The more we advance towards the completion of the project, the more minor the changes are, and this is quite normal. These changes that you find minor and irritating, others consider them essential. (For example, if we do nothing, Δ% will not be on the final version! :mrgreen: )
Yes, you have to adapt to it, but it's a small price to pay when you have the privilege of being one of the testers.

  Optimot : The ⌥ keyboard layout optimized for French and English (ŵïþ ʃʉŋ 𝕂åʁɒꝃțɛɹṩ).
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Jaymos
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Re: C43 bezel expected when?

Post by Jaymos »

pm42 wrote:
Sat Mar 11, 2023 4:30 pm
What would we do with blank overlays?
I have no idea why it would be wanted.
BTW, as far as I'm concerned, changing the layout is not cool. The added value is very low except to satisfy the geekness of people who are able to obsess over details on the Internet for months (and this is said kindly from someone who wrote a FX-702p emulator as well as other contributions and cut his C43 overlays with a laser).
But for most of the people who already use the calculator, have overlays, are familiar with a layout, this is just a pain in the ass.
Most impressive is the fact you also like the FX-702P - That was a favourite of mine at the time.

I am sorry to hear you don't like the C47 layout. Don't laser another one though until our files are final. I will be posting some info on the new thread.
At least, supporting the misc layout versions in the firmware would allow us to choose whether we have to change our overlays and habits just to get the new functions and bug fixes.
We are indeed supporting the C43 layout. Look at the KEYS menu and select C43. Note that the two "Alt" layouts in the KEYS menu are depreciated.
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20230311-21272400.bmp
20230311-21272400.bmp (12.31 KiB) Viewed 841 times
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I do suggest that people try C47. There has a lot of thought and discussion gone into every key that changed. I can understand you may think is is just a few unnecessary small changes - it was no small change to us at least. What is even more, I can say that after using it even on simulator for 2 days during testing, I noted to the team how clunky the C43 layout felt to me when I accidentally used that again, which in itself is testimony that the new layout is more intuitive even for a seasoned C43 user like me. Might be different for you of course - I respect that.
Jaco Mostert
Elec Eng, South Africa
https://47calc.com C47 (s/n 03818 & 06199), WP43 (0015). In box: HP42S, HP32Sii, WP34S&C, HP28C, HP35s, EL-506P, EL-W506, PB700; ex: FX702P, 11C, HP67 & HP85; iOS: 42s Byron, Free42+, WP31S/34S, HCalc.
Pyjam
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Re: C43 bezel expected when?

Post by Pyjam »

The only time I published a program in a magazine was for the 702P. A domino game. :P

  Optimot : The ⌥ keyboard layout optimized for French and English (ŵïþ ʃʉŋ 𝕂åʁɒꝃțɛɹṩ).
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rudi
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Re: C43 bezel expected when?

Post by rudi »

@Jaymos, for the HP-41 You had many different labels, also empty ones and a sheet of preprinted and blank stickers.
I actually used this a lot, when I was sailing. One for astronomical navigation, one for radar target plotting (calculating CPA, TCPA, …) and one for stability calculations.

https://images.app.goo.gl/gwwE7u5R87rq6Zrc6
/Rudi

DM-42 (s/n 06999), HP-42S, HP-35s, HP-11c, HP-32SII (ex HP-41CV, ex HP-75C, ex HP-48G + a lot, really lot of a accessories)
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pm42
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Re: C43 bezel expected when?

Post by pm42 »

Jaymos wrote:
Sat Mar 11, 2023 8:41 pm
Most impressive is the fact you also like the FX-702P - That was a favourite of mine at the time.
This was my calculator from High School till my university degree. So I had it for 40 years and it still works but I do not use it anymore.
Very nice little computer at the time.
Jaymos wrote:
Sat Mar 11, 2023 8:41 pm
I am sorry to hear you don't like the C47 layout. Don't laser another one though until our files are final. I will be posting some info on the new thread.
I'll keep an open mind and test it.
We are indeed supporting the C43 layout. Look at the KEYS menu and select C43. Note that the two "Alt" layouts in the KEYS menu are depreciated.
Great.
I do suggest that people try C47. There has a lot of thought and discussion gone into every key that changed. I can understand you may think is is just a few unnecessary small changes - it was no small change to us at least. What is even more, I can say that after using it even on simulator for 2 days during testing, I noted to the team how clunky the C43 layout felt to me when I accidentally used that again, which in itself is testimony that the new layout is more intuitive even for a seasoned C43 user like me. Might be different for you of course - I respect that.
Wow, you know how to sell ;)


Pyjam wrote:
Sat Mar 11, 2023 8:57 pm
The only time I published a program in a magazine was for the 702P. A domino game. :P
I was into astronomy at the time (still today) and I wrote a program to compute planets positions at a time were they were only available on paper. It took me a while because it was sophomore year and the maths were not obvious.
Years later I found it, wanted to test it again and ended up spending some time over 3 years to write the emulator.
I'm proud to be obsessive, maniac and a geek :mrgreen:
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Jaymos
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Re: C43 bezel expected when?

Post by Jaymos »

Pyjam wrote:
Sat Mar 11, 2023 8:57 pm
The only time I published a program in a magazine was for the 702P. A domino game. :P
Do you remember the Wumpus game? - I found it fascinating and programmed it in my 702P as a teen. Does anyone? I think the rival at school was the Sharp PC-1211 in my opinion not a match.

The beauty is that decades later, I had to make a fancy hardware dongle at work to protect software in an industrial PC. I used a 12C508 and programmed a state map in the shape of the Wumpus dodecahedron, with secret data at every room/node/state. The "Wumpus" was a state machine that responded to a single bit stream, exactly as Turing would. I really enjoyed myself all due to the games on the 702P, shaping my mind.
Jaco Mostert
Elec Eng, South Africa
https://47calc.com C47 (s/n 03818 & 06199), WP43 (0015). In box: HP42S, HP32Sii, WP34S&C, HP28C, HP35s, EL-506P, EL-W506, PB700; ex: FX702P, 11C, HP67 & HP85; iOS: 42s Byron, Free42+, WP31S/34S, HCalc.
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RJvM
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Re: C43 bezel expected when?

Post by RJvM »

rudi wrote:
Sat Mar 11, 2023 9:11 pm

https://images.app.goo.gl/gwwE7u5R87rq6Zrc6
Your link generates an error (malformed)
Robbert Jan, MSEE, RPN user since 1976 and a collector for many years I now own all the important ones: HP-35, 45, 55, 65, 97, 19, 21, 25, 34, 10-16, 41, 42, 71, 48, 50, Prime, DM41, DM42, WP43, C47, R47; Project 47 team member https://47calc.com
Pyjam
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Re: C43 bezel expected when?

Post by Pyjam »

I didn’t know it. I live in France, and at that time I had access only to the French press. I read and have published in the "famous" magazine « L’Ordinateur de poche ».
« Jeux & Stratégie » was another famous magazine at the time and has some game programs for TI and HP but no Wumpus.
(My best friend had the PC-1211.)

  Optimot : The ⌥ keyboard layout optimized for French and English (ŵïþ ʃʉŋ 𝕂åʁɒꝃțɛɹṩ).
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