43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

General discussion about calculators, SwissMicros or otherwise
Dani R.
Posts: 302
Joined: Fri May 05, 2017 10:23 pm

Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by Dani R. »

Walter wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 4:08 pm
Dani R. wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 2:15 pm
To illustrate what is currently under discussion, here is the current keyboard sequence to type "Pi^42":
[ 7 ]
f(SIN)
[Rv]
...
Just for comparison, the sequence on the 43S looks like this:
[down]
g( 8 )
g( - )
[down]
g(FN2)
f(EEX)
f( 4 )
f(EEX)
f( 2 )

FWIW.

Confirmed. The idea was to show an useless example with upper and lower case. Without optimized scrolling through the menus.
DM42 SN:00032
Dani R.
Posts: 302
Joined: Fri May 05, 2017 10:23 pm

Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by Dani R. »

"Caps Lock" on = f[Up]
"Caps Lock" off / "Num Lock" off = f[Dn]
"Num Lock" on = f [ENTER]
Shift digits up = g[up]
subscripts = g[Dn]

No f- positions needed on the first three lines.




Or provide this ALPHA mode as a special mode in parallel to the more WP43S-typical way of text processing as a configuration, such as eRPN? Then the digits could stay on the f-keys, for those who like it.
DM42 SN:00032
User avatar
Jaymos
Posts: 662
Joined: Sun Nov 04, 2018 7:03 pm
Location: Cape Town

Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by Jaymos »

Dani R. wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 7:35 pm
"Caps Lock" on = f[Up]
"Caps Lock" off / "Num Lock" off = f[Dn]
"Num Lock" on = f [ENTER]
Shift digits up = g[up]
subscripts = g[Dn]

No f- positions needed on the first three lines.

Or provide this ALPHA mode as a special mode in parallel to the more WP43S-typical way of text processing as a configuration, such as eRPN? Then the digits could stay on the f-keys, for those who like it.
I am working through the previous mails. Also I have finished implementing the numLock = g[Up] and g[Dn] and capsLock = f[Up] and f[Dn] which I like a lot.

I also like this latest suggestion to remove super/sup and the C and N toggles a lot. Even though they could arguably stay but not on the template, resulting in a clean top three lines without distractions.

l see the single character sup/subscript also as being foreign. Maybe we should lock the sub/sub too. I see an interesting solution since the modes are mutually exclusive: Context sensitive f[Up] & f[Dn]: It is possible to set 6 modes with four arrow buttons, excluding the ENTER involvement. My mind sees this very logical, shifting levels up and down. But I need comment if it is overloading!

Define three modes or levels: +1=numlock, 0=caps & no numlock, -1=no caps
Let f[Up] add 1, and f[Dn] subtract 1, clipping to the extremes, i.e. no wraparound.

f[Up]: if (0)default "A" then (1)turn numlock on.
f[Up]: if (-1)"a" then (0)turn caps lock on.
f[Dn]: if (1)numlock then (0)clear numlock.
f[Dn]: if (0)"A" then (-1)caps lock off.

Define three modes or levels: +1=superscript, 0=normal, -1=subscript.
Let g[Up] add 1, and g[Dn] subtract 1, clipping to the extremes, i.e. no wraparound.

g[Up]: if (0)normal then turn (1)superscript lock
g[Up]: if (-1)subscript lock, turn (0)normal
g[Dn]: if (1)superscript lock, turn (0)normal
g[Dn]: if (0)normal then turn (-1)subscript lock

This makes it easy to comprehend and indicated as previously stated A/a/Ω/𝞈/ℕ/n/↑/↓.
f is caps/num locks and g is sup/sub locks. Up to increase locks. Dn to decrease locks.

How does it sound? Or is it another brain fart ?

J
Jaco Mostert
Elec Eng, South Africa
C43 (WP34C) on DM42 sn. 03818 & 06199 for complex math, HP42S; HP32Sii, WP34S&C, HP28C, HP35s, EL-506P, EL-W506, PB700; owned FX702P & 11C; used HP67 & HP85; iOS: 42s Byron, Free42, WP31S/34S, HCalc.
User avatar
H2X
Posts: 607
Joined: Tue Apr 25, 2017 8:00 am
Location: Norway

Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by H2X »

Jaymos wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 8:55 pm
How does it sound? Or is it another brain fart ?
The pudding proof! :D
DM42 #40 running C43 | DM41X #50 | various HP models
The earth is flat. It just appears round because it is massive and curves spacetime.
Dani R.
Posts: 302
Joined: Fri May 05, 2017 10:23 pm

Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by Dani R. »

Jaymos wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 8:55 pm
...
How does it sound? ...

I would cope with it. I'm not sure yet if everyone can handle it. Pudding proof, why not.

I think if Caps/Num Lock is changed, subscript/superscript should also be deleted.

Probably the state of Caps/Num Lock should not be saved persistently, but always start with Caps Lock when the AIM is opened again.
DM42 SN:00032
Dani R.
Posts: 302
Joined: Fri May 05, 2017 10:23 pm

Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by Dani R. »

I still like the shifting of superscript and subscript to g[Up] and g[Dn], latched, still. I hope we will not hinder any other application in the long run.

A question: Is HOME supported and needed in AIM? Otherwise we could use additional triple click for "Num Lock" on/off.
I see no compelling reason why f[ENTER] and g[ENTER] should not be used in AIM, but maybe a certain restraint is quite appropriate.
DM42 SN:00032
User avatar
Walter
Posts: 1718
Joined: Tue May 02, 2017 11:13 am
Location: Close to FRA, Germany

Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by Walter »

Dani R. wrote:
Tue Dec 08, 2020 11:30 am
... Otherwise we could use additional triple click for "Num Lock" on/off...
Triple click! :shock: I'm less than not convinced that shall be good UI design. Though this is my personal view only.
DM42 SN: 00041 β
WP 43S running on this device

HP-35, HP-45, ..., HP-35S, WP 34S, WP 31S, DM16L
User avatar
Jaymos
Posts: 662
Joined: Sun Nov 04, 2018 7:03 pm
Location: Cape Town

Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by Jaymos »

Walter wrote:
Tue Dec 08, 2020 11:43 am
Dani R. wrote:
Tue Dec 08, 2020 11:30 am
... Otherwise we could use additional triple click for "Num Lock" on/off...
Triple click! :shock: I'm less than not convinced that shall be good UI design. Though this is my personal view only.
Well, it is extremely easy to taste, pudding wise, as the code for the triple click HOME is mature, and the behaviour for AIM was already there albeit in empty curly brackets up to now. Done.

It works nicely and since you need triple click in AIM for nothing else, until it bothers someone may stay ;-)

I am almost ready with a test release, testing many of the things discussed here. Dani, I will mail you in a short time to get a Windows version compiled for tasting, for when you do have some time to eat ;-)
Jaco Mostert
Elec Eng, South Africa
C43 (WP34C) on DM42 sn. 03818 & 06199 for complex math, HP42S; HP32Sii, WP34S&C, HP28C, HP35s, EL-506P, EL-W506, PB700; owned FX702P & 11C; used HP67 & HP85; iOS: 42s Byron, Free42, WP31S/34S, HCalc.
User avatar
akaTB
Posts: 563
Joined: Tue May 02, 2017 1:56 pm
Location: Milan, Italy

Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by akaTB »

Walter wrote:
Tue Dec 08, 2020 11:43 am
Dani R. wrote:
Tue Dec 08, 2020 11:30 am
... Otherwise we could use additional triple click for "Num Lock" on/off...
Triple click! :shock: I'm less than not convinced that shall be good UI design. Though this is my personal view only.
Time for the ultimate UI!

https://youtu.be/LhFTZ7ekLEE
Greetings,
    Massimo
ajcaton
-+×÷ left is right and right is wrong :twisted: Casted in gold
User avatar
Jaymos
Posts: 662
Joined: Sun Nov 04, 2018 7:03 pm
Location: Cape Town

Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by Jaymos »

akaTB wrote:
Tue Dec 08, 2020 2:42 pm
Walter wrote:
Tue Dec 08, 2020 11:43 am
Dani R. wrote:
Tue Dec 08, 2020 11:30 am
... Otherwise we could use additional triple click for "Num Lock" on/off...
Triple click! :shock: I'm less than not convinced that shall be good UI design. Though this is my personal view only.
Time for the ultimate UI!

https://youtu.be/LhFTZ7ekLEE

Yes, we can get rid of 36 keys .... ;-)
Jaco Mostert
Elec Eng, South Africa
C43 (WP34C) on DM42 sn. 03818 & 06199 for complex math, HP42S; HP32Sii, WP34S&C, HP28C, HP35s, EL-506P, EL-W506, PB700; owned FX702P & 11C; used HP67 & HP85; iOS: 42s Byron, Free42, WP31S/34S, HCalc.
Post Reply