43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

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Guenter
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Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by Guenter » Sat Sep 28, 2019 12:53 pm

At the hhc 2019 there was some spare time available, therefor I thought it's a good opportunity to talk about the WP43C. A quarter hour before my talk, I quickly hacked some words together. So please bear with me when it seems to be confusing and stumbling at times.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s5GN1Jz3RpA

I hope I got it mostly right, so Walter and Jaco don't shoot at me. The pictures were taken from this thread and Walter's thread "WP43S News".

Günter
DM42 SN:00004 and SN:00184

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H2X
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Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by H2X » Sat Sep 28, 2019 6:58 pm

Guenter wrote:
Sat Sep 28, 2019 12:53 pm
At the hhc 2019 there was some spare time available, therefor I thought it's a good opportunity to talk about the WP43C. A quarter hour before my talk, I quickly hacked some words together. So please bear with me when it seems to be confusing and stumbling at times.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s5GN1Jz3RpA

I hope I got it mostly right, so Walter and Jaco don't shoot at me. The pictures were taken from this thread and Walter's thread "WP43S News".

Günter
Nice, Günter!

I think I heard you mention that the WP43C was not intended to have a faceplate with the blue labels, as it was only meant to "live" until the WP43S comes alive.

There is actually talk about a custom faceplate, and I for one certainly hope it lives on past the WP43S launch. I do prefer the C keyboard layout, and much of the other customizations make sense to me as well. I suspect I am not alone...
DM42 SN:00040 | Without deviation from the norm, progress is not possible - Frank Zappa

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Guenter
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Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by Guenter » Sat Sep 28, 2019 10:52 pm

H2X wrote:
Sat Sep 28, 2019 6:58 pm

Nice, Günter!

I think I heard you mention that the WP43C was not intended to have a faceplate with the blue labels, as it was only meant to "live" until the WP43S comes alive.

There is actually talk about a custom faceplate, and I for one certainly hope it lives on past the WP43S launch. I do prefer the C keyboard layout, and much of the other customizations make sense to me as well. I suspect I am not alone...
Thanks for your kind words. Sorry that I probably got this one with the faceplate wrong. I certainly also would love to have that overlay available, that would give a lot of flexibility. Perhaps you can give a respective comment to the video.

Günter
DM42 SN:00004 and SN:00184

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Jaymos
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Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by Jaymos » Sat Sep 28, 2019 11:01 pm

Well done Guenter!

Glad you could squeeze in a talk on the WP43C. You did well with the confusion, and properly clarified the whole situation in the end.

No major issues in the talk, the only one worth mentioning the status of the layouts, let me summarise:

WP43C Layout 2 is the one demo’d at hhc. No issues. No template is needed nor planned. This layout also contains the expanded HOME menu with the blue label indexes.

WP43C Layout 1A is a slight variation on L2 where less of the yellow labels correspond with DM42. Because of that, this one needs a printed template and a template is planned. Design is in progress. Material of the template is not yet finalised. SwissMicros stated they will make a template.
Jaco Mostert
Elec Eng, South Africa
WP34C, HP42S, DM42 for complex math; 35S, 28C, 32Sii, WP34S, EL-506P, EL-W506, PB700; owned FX702P & 11C; used 67 & 85. iOS: 42s (Byron), Free42, WP31S/34S, HCalc.
43S operators right. DM42 sn. 03818.

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ijabbott
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Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by ijabbott » Sun Sep 29, 2019 6:03 am

Guenter wrote:
Sat Sep 28, 2019 10:52 pm
H2X wrote:
Sat Sep 28, 2019 6:58 pm

Nice, Günter!

I think I heard you mention that the WP43C was not intended to have a faceplate with the blue labels, as it was only meant to "live" until the WP43S comes alive.

There is actually talk about a custom faceplate, and I for one certainly hope it lives on past the WP43S launch. I do prefer the C keyboard layout, and much of the other customizations make sense to me as well. I suspect I am not alone...
Thanks for your kind words. Sorry that I probably got this one with the faceplate wrong. I certainly also would love to have that overlay available, that would give a lot of flexibility. Perhaps you can give a respective comment to the video.

Günter
I think there will be a (small) market for custom-printed overlays once the new DM41X comes out, so whoever makes those ought to be easily persuaded to add a WP43C overlay to the collection.

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Jaymos
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Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by Jaymos » Sun Sep 29, 2019 10:13 am

Jaymos wrote:
Thu Sep 26, 2019 8:24 am
In summary, as I understand, you propose one step further, i.e. to rather optionally prevent CC from having 42S compatibility, and also to introduce a new command COMPLEX, which only has 42S compatibility.

I am liking your idea of a separate COMPLEX function, for the reason that I try keep the existing commands (CC) standard for the purposes of future programming complications.

I can do this without flags by simply adding 2 wrappers to CC, one called COMPLEX for strict 42S compatibility and another called say CC1. We would use USER to replace the yellow COMPLEX with either CC or CC1. And if you need both, replace top left Σ+ with CC1.
I looked at the code and the implementation of the above seems very easy.

Mid next week I will do the following:

1. Rename COMPLEX back to CC. Previously it was just a name change Cc—>COMPLEX to suit the 42S text. Now it it needs function changes.

2. Add CC1 which does only the interactive NIM part of CC. Or shall I make it CC_INT or CC_IM or CC_ALT?

3. Add COMPLEX which only does the 42S style.

4. Assign the new COMPLEX to the 43C Key. And leave the other two for assigned USER mode alternatives.

I am still away from home and not at my dev tools, hence this has got to wait, otherwise this would have been done.
Jaco Mostert
Elec Eng, South Africa
WP34C, HP42S, DM42 for complex math; 35S, 28C, 32Sii, WP34S, EL-506P, EL-W506, PB700; owned FX702P & 11C; used 67 & 85. iOS: 42s (Byron), Free42, WP31S/34S, HCalc.
43S operators right. DM42 sn. 03818.

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Jaymos
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Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by Jaymos » Sun Sep 29, 2019 6:27 pm

I made a little 20 minute WP43C demo video this afternoon.

https://youtu.be/ty1Oz91Xw1Y

The sharpness of the video broke though, or maybe it is my ignorance of the video process - the original was 1.5 GB in HD and sharp, but after rotation, compression and upload to Youtube it looked like this - maybe I get it better next time round. I think it still gets to the point even though the quality is bad.

The main issues I wanted to illustrate are the purpose of the whole thing, single shift key operation, HOME menu and changing calculator firmware using DMCP. I could not resist throwing in long integer calculations...

J
Jaco Mostert
Elec Eng, South Africa
WP34C, HP42S, DM42 for complex math; 35S, 28C, 32Sii, WP34S, EL-506P, EL-W506, PB700; owned FX702P & 11C; used 67 & 85. iOS: 42s (Byron), Free42, WP31S/34S, HCalc.
43S operators right. DM42 sn. 03818.

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inautilus
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Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by inautilus » Sun Sep 29, 2019 7:23 pm

Great video Jaymos … !

This will certainly build on Günter’s presentation at this year’s HHC in Reno … thanks Günter :) … and should definitely help in addressing any lingering questions enthusiasts might have regarding the WP43C.

Well, it looks like a trip to HHC 2020 (wherever it is) is now a ‘must go’. Hope to see you there … :D
Last edited by inautilus on Sun Sep 29, 2019 7:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
D A MacDonald
Mar Eng, Designer, CANADA
HP35, HP41C, HP28S, HP35s. PC: HP15C, Free42, WP31S, WP34S
(Operators Right in bold)
"It is not the strongest or most intelligent who will survive but those who can best manage change ..." Darwin

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Guenter
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Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by Guenter » Sun Sep 29, 2019 7:47 pm

Jaymos wrote:
Sat Sep 28, 2019 11:01 pm
Well done Guenter!

Glad you could squeeze in a talk on the WP43C. You did well with the confusion, and properly clarified the whole situation in the end.

No major issues in the talk, the only one worth mentioning the status of the layouts, let me summarise:

WP43C Layout 2 is the one demo’d at hhc. No issues. No template is needed nor planned. This layout also contains the expanded HOME menu with the blue label indexes.

WP43C Layout 1A is a slight variation on L2 where less of the yellow labels correspond with DM42. Because of that, this one needs a printed template and a template is planned. Design is in progress. Material of the template is not yet finalised. SwissMicros stated they will make a template.
Thanks Jaco,

I copied your comments about the layout to a thread at the hpmuseum.org under the title "HHC 2019 WP43C addendum" I guess that's of interest for a lot of people.

Günter
DM42 SN:00004 and SN:00184

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Guenter
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Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by Guenter » Sun Sep 29, 2019 8:03 pm

When entering the "STAT" menu the ∑+ is on the unshifted plane while ∑- is on the (f)shifted plane. As the ∑+ is already directly available on the keyboard I think the ∑- should be on the unshifted plane for convenience and the ∑+ could go to the (f)shifted plane.

Günter
DM42 SN:00004 and SN:00184

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