43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

General discussion about calculators, Swiss Micros or otherwise
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Jaymos
Posts: 518
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Location: Cape Town

Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by Jaymos » Wed Aug 21, 2019 11:06 am

inautilus wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 11:01 am
No need for concern. Will fill you in on the solution(s) in a few hours or so when freed up ...
I've got this :)
Great.

Look in you pm anyway.

I bought a font editor now and can adapt any of the font glyphs as needed. The one sent was a quick 50% compression done on the whole font.
Jaco Mostert
Elec Eng, South Africa
WP34C, HP42S, DM42 for complex math; 35S, 28C, 32Sii, WP34S, EL-506P, EL-W506, PB700; owned FX702P & 11C; used 67 & 85. iOS: 42s (Byron), Free42, WP31S/34S, HCalc.
43S operators right. DM42 sn. 03818.

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inautilus
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Location: Cape Breton, Nova Scotia, CANADA

Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by inautilus » Wed Aug 21, 2019 11:37 am

Did you already buy it yet ... because you may not have had to. I've got a professor friend who teaches AutoCAD to engineering students at the the university, and an Dept Head friend at the local collge where I taught (she's Graphic Design) ... they will both have their own copies of the AutoCAD Vectorising software. Just saying, if you haven't already bought it yet, maybe save the funds for your trip! Either way ... Thank you very much!
D A MacDonald
Mar Eng, Designer, CANADA
HP35, HP41C, HP28S, HP35s. PC: HP15C, Free42, WP31S, WP34S
(Operators Right in bold)
"It is not the strongest or most intelligent who will survive but those who can best manage change ..." Darwin

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Jaymos
Posts: 518
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Location: Cape Town

Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by Jaymos » Wed Aug 21, 2019 11:42 am

inautilus wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 11:37 am
Did you already buy it yet ... because you may not have had to. I've got a professor friend who teaches AutoCAD to engineering students at the the university, and an Dept Head friend at the local collge where I taught (she's Graphic Design) ... they will both have their own copies of the AutoCAD Vectorising software. Just saying, if you haven't already bought it yet, maybe save the funds for your trip! Either way ... Thank you very much!
I have it already. Whichever way we need it, on whichever TTF font or glyph, it can be used for the calc.

I wanted it any way because I had too much manual work done on the previous calculator. Free tools often only bring one to a point only.
Jaco Mostert
Elec Eng, South Africa
WP34C, HP42S, DM42 for complex math; 35S, 28C, 32Sii, WP34S, EL-506P, EL-W506, PB700; owned FX702P & 11C; used 67 & 85. iOS: 42s (Byron), Free42, WP31S/34S, HCalc.
43S operators right. DM42 sn. 03818.

Dani R.
Posts: 264
Joined: Fri May 05, 2017 8:23 pm

Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by Dani R. » Wed Aug 21, 2019 2:50 pm

To give you a better impression of how an overlay might look like, I have attached three pictures. First the DM42 and the Text Editor overlay for the DM-41. Then the two crops in the same scale from the DM-41 Text Editor overlay and from the DM42.
Attachments
DM42_and_DM-41_Text_Editor.jpg
DM42_and_DM-41_Text_Editor.jpg (241.8 KiB) Viewed 423 times
DM-41_Text_Editor_crop.jpg
DM-41_Text_Editor_crop.jpg (246.98 KiB) Viewed 423 times
DM42_crop.jpg
DM42_crop.jpg (247.96 KiB) Viewed 423 times
DM42 SN:00032

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inautilus
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Location: Cape Breton, Nova Scotia, CANADA

Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by inautilus » Wed Aug 21, 2019 4:35 pm

Jaymos wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 11:42 am
inautilus wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 11:37 am
Did you already buy it yet ...
... Either way ... Thank you very much!
I have it already. Whichever way we need it, on whichever TTF font or glyph, it can be used for the calc.

I wanted it any way because I had too much manual work done on the previous calculator. Free tools often only bring one to a point only.


What is the name of the vectorizing software that you decided on … and would you recommend it? I was thinking that this is definitely one of those necessities that one can't do without. Did TTCONV make it to your short list?

Anyway, the TM50 compression worked like a charm ... as they say. Just go to the link below to see a quick 60 second test file.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1PvRQI ... YBCLqsibHM

(Does it take very log to generate each letter/number set?)
D A MacDonald
Mar Eng, Designer, CANADA
HP35, HP41C, HP28S, HP35s. PC: HP15C, Free42, WP31S, WP34S
(Operators Right in bold)
"It is not the strongest or most intelligent who will survive but those who can best manage change ..." Darwin

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Jaymos
Posts: 518
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Location: Cape Town

Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by Jaymos » Wed Aug 21, 2019 5:22 pm

inautilus wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 4:35 pm
Jaymos wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 11:42 am
inautilus wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 11:37 am
Did you already buy it yet ...
... Either way ... Thank you very much!
I have it already. Whichever way we need it, on whichever TTF font or glyph, it can be used for the calc.

I wanted it any way because I had too much manual work done on the previous calculator. Free tools often only bring one to a point only.


What is the name of the vectorizing software that you decided on … and would you recommend it? I was thinking that this is definitely one of those necessities that one can't do without. Did TTCONV make it to your short list?

Anyway, the TM50 compression worked like a charm ... as they say. Just go to the link below to see a quick 60 second test file.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1PvRQI ... YBCLqsibHM

(Does it take very log to generate each letter/number set?)

Great. Glad Autocad can be fooled with something !! Not great reviews on their font handling, but this is good news.

The software I got is FontCreator, the home edition is on discount for USD49 until 24th Aug.

There is an auto "Glyph Transformer" function which does the whole set automatically. The quick 50% font test I did was done on the automatic one.
The catch is: This auto function is not available on the Home edition. You got to pay USD100 or so more to get the std edition to do this.

I did the auto conversion using the free 30 day demo, but I found I could not save the font. So I bought the basic license, registered with the conversion in memory, then I could save the auto generated font, which I sent you. When I went into the program, I saw I can still not use the auto, because I bought the wrong license. I will not spend USD150+ for that. But the USD49 is worth it. I always fiddle with fonts, and this is a nice tool.

So, I found another very nice open free font, call FiraSans, loaded it, and manually adjusted each letter to 50%. I also modified some CenturySchoolbook x,y,z,i,j, pi, e glyphs, and stuck it into a new font set. That I sent you a few minutes ago.

Note that the x,y,z and j glyphs are movies, also the sum and product of signs, also modified for impact on a small device. The strokes are wildly thicker (;-)) but still not as thick as the HP fonts. Try it. The other are various fonts I previously used and stored, which easily copies and pastes into the new JM Collection font.

I pm's you the Word file and font for you to try on the calculator.
Capture1.PNG
Capture1.PNG (35.92 KiB) Viewed 409 times
Jaco Mostert
Elec Eng, South Africa
WP34C, HP42S, DM42 for complex math; 35S, 28C, 32Sii, WP34S, EL-506P, EL-W506, PB700; owned FX702P & 11C; used 67 & 85. iOS: 42s (Byron), Free42, WP31S/34S, HCalc.
43S operators right. DM42 sn. 03818.

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Jaymos
Posts: 518
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Location: Cape Town

Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by Jaymos » Wed Aug 21, 2019 6:16 pm

inautilus wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 1:41 am
Jaymos wrote:
Tue Aug 20, 2019 6:14 pm
The presumption is that we all like Layout 1, as we haven't heard complaints on Layout 1 for a while. The challenge is,

Is Layout 1 is the ultimate keyboard according to my goals? Or is the challenger more practical.

LEFT is LAYOUT 1

RIGHT is the challenger LAYOUT 1A

Thoughts? I quite like the challenger.

If the intent is to group as many like-minded FN's and Menus together ... as much as possible ... then it makes total sense to head in the direction of the challenger 1A. I think it very practical to send as many of the 'utility' fellows over to their corner, to hang out together. :D
The overall intent is not grouping - it is ergonomic spacing. The near perfect grouping is a mathematical tool we use, hoping that the usability will improve in a good ergonomically way.

My question is whether the precision and effort to create L1A resulted in a layout more USABLE than L1.

Future users must say about that USABILITY: Layout 1 or Layout 1A for the official 43C template.

Interestingly, this is where opinion good or bad counts, not precision or technique such as grouping.
Jaco Mostert
Elec Eng, South Africa
WP34C, HP42S, DM42 for complex math; 35S, 28C, 32Sii, WP34S, EL-506P, EL-W506, PB700; owned FX702P & 11C; used 67 & 85. iOS: 42s (Byron), Free42, WP31S/34S, HCalc.
43S operators right. DM42 sn. 03818.

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inautilus
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Location: Cape Breton, Nova Scotia, CANADA

Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by inautilus » Wed Aug 21, 2019 7:14 pm

Either way, whether I acquire some new software or not, I should be able to put together a small varied collection of further refined renderings suitable for review for the first of next week. (You mentioned you have a trip ... so then perhaps first of the week will be good for you ...?)

In the meantime I have to get back to Dani on the 'overlay' / template info he kindly forwarded. I may have some usable photos to add to that mix as well.

You had also mentioned that you might be able to have some renderings printed off (full scale). So, just pick from the preliminary ones sent so far and I will go over them, and give them a quick clean up before re-sending. They are pretty high resolution (approximately 20,000 x 10,735 pixels) so should yield a high quality print. I think the aspect ratio is right ( dims 144mm x 77mm).

That's a lot. Do you need anything else.
D A MacDonald
Mar Eng, Designer, CANADA
HP35, HP41C, HP28S, HP35s. PC: HP15C, Free42, WP31S, WP34S
(Operators Right in bold)
"It is not the strongest or most intelligent who will survive but those who can best manage change ..." Darwin

Dani R.
Posts: 264
Joined: Fri May 05, 2017 8:23 pm

Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by Dani R. » Wed Aug 21, 2019 7:25 pm

Grouping, I read grouping again. I have prepared something.

Jaymos wrote:
Tue Aug 20, 2019 5:29 pm
...
Below the L1A layout, with the logical groups marked. Interesting.

Image
I mean, it's really interesting. Some thoughts about the possible layout 1B, which can't be realized because we said that ALPHA.FN[g][ 4 ] and SHOW[f][ . ] are determined. But what do I care about my chatter from yesterday?

I have now seen what I have suspected for some time. CLK wants to get close to CONV. So CLK[g][ 4 ]. But how can you explain that ALPHA.FN is not next to ALPHA? Not at all, unless you would rename the menu to TXT.FN, i.e. TXT.FN[g][ - ], near the programming functions.

You could also exchange TIMER and SHOW. I don't think SHOW is stored in the muscle memory.

But these two substitutions are hypothetical. :lol:
DM42 SN:00032

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Jaymos
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Re: 43S Alternative key layout --> WP43C

Post by Jaymos » Wed Aug 21, 2019 7:26 pm

inautilus wrote:
Wed Aug 21, 2019 7:14 pm
Either way, whether I acquire some new software or not, I should be able to put together a small varied collection of further refined renderings suitable for review for the first of next week. (You mentioned you have a trip ... so then perhaps first of the week will be good for you ...?)

In the meantime I have to get back to Dani on the 'overlay' / template info he kindly forwarded. I may have some usable photos to add to that mix as well.

You had also mentioned that you might be able to have some renderings printed off (full scale). So, just pick from the preliminary ones sent so far and I will go over them, and give them a quick clean up before re-sending. They are pretty high resolution (approximately 20,000 x 10,735 pixels) so should yield a high quality print. I think the aspect ratio is right ( dims 144mm x 77mm).

That's a lot. Do you need anything else.
Hi

Nothing else.
I will be on a work trip for two days Thu/Fri. I will be without my toys until Friday evening ;-) Then I have another work trip Mon/Tue. So by Tue night I will have my toys again (Mac + DM42) for proper responses.

On Saturday I want to go print some photos at the shop, so if you clean up your files before Friday night (GMT+2) for Saturday, it would be great.

In between, I will be reading and responding on my iPhone.
Jaco Mostert
Elec Eng, South Africa
WP34C, HP42S, DM42 for complex math; 35S, 28C, 32Sii, WP34S, EL-506P, EL-W506, PB700; owned FX702P & 11C; used 67 & 85. iOS: 42s (Byron), Free42, WP31S/34S, HCalc.
43S operators right. DM42 sn. 03818.

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